Maybe it would be better to repeatedly offer a poll with the compensation amount initially set to a maximum value and lower it gradually until a vote passes or zero is reached? This would minimize necessary actions for MKR holders.
This argument can be equally applied in the case of smart contract breach. If tomorrow a hacker finds a bug in a smart contract and drains all vaults, one can argue that anyone, who took time to understand the smart contract, should be aware of the risks.
I also want to share how I view the problem using an analogy (I’d like to make comics instead but I can’t draw).
On a distant and very similar planet in the Multiverse… an open-source airplane industry arises. Once, a plane crashes. Families of the air crash victims ask for compensation but an air company denies arguing that all blueprints and specs of aircraft are accessible in a public library and contain all information regarding risks.
On a distant and bla bla bla… A plane crashes because a control tower is silent at the moment of landing approach. A company that develops airplanes, control towers, and related technologies argues it’s not liable because all information regarding air control is accessible and everyone is aware of the risks. It’s a common-sense that air controllers are humans and on some very hot days they drink too much water and can simultaneously leave a tower to go to a toilet.
I’m not saying these analogies have no flaws, it’s just a way to look at the problem from a different angle.
There will be a moment, when all 0 bid victims walk the streets and start a riot (on Twitter, Youtube…). It is of highest importance to compensate all victims to the fullest. That way the trust in MakerDao will be restored and reinforced. The Market will react accordingly. Do not forget, that the compensation must include loss of future profits. So compensation must be in ETH.
I like and use the Maker project.
I hold MKR.
If Maker is not moving fast, than I will jump ship at the next opportunity. Sell my MKR and move my CDP’s.
In my opinion, any compensation should be for the dollar value that would have been returned at time of liquidation if the market had been operating efficiently.
I doubt that anyone saying it should be in Ether, with all fluctuations after that point, would be saying that if the price of Ether were lower now.
Capital has opportunity cost, period.
Should they’ve be compensated on day 1 or in a time manner, there shouldn’t be any argument on which token the compensation should be dominated.
It’s customers’ choice where to put their money.
Given the opportunities nowadays in Defi, how much would be the yield if one puts the compensation (whether being ETH or USD) into YFI farming? Note, most of those victims are defi pioneers and would most likely join Defi farming.
I’m just wondering: will any of the “traditional” business in U.S take MakerDao’s stance when dealing with their seed customers (which could be very precious)? Just look around.
I’m sorry to say, but MakerDao is decentralized only when it comes to responsibility.
Well - it is ETH in my case. My CDP was in ETH. Maker CDP’s are simple long positions for ETH, BAT now also KNC. All my trading is based on ETH. Not Satoshi (aka BTC). So yes. It is natural to be compensated in the currency, which was lost or maybe stolen from or maybe by the company holding it for me. We crypto people don’t care about USD. We do know the risk. When we are going long on ETH. We know what we are doing.
All the dezentralised shorts can be done on dydx. You go to MakerDao for long position, dydx for short positions.
On black thursday i sold all of my alts in to ETH… Locked them in to the CDP. Then boarded a plane. When it landed, then it was alraedy too late. 0 bid.
Since then i was working hard (doing real work) to get some small position of ETH build. I was not saying or writing anything. I was waiting for MakerDAO to show face and maybe acting fast before the imminent bull run, to compensate the 0-bid victims.
All 0-bid victims are decapitated Bulls.
All the decapitated Bulls voices will get louder, when we go further in to the bullrun. All the unrealised gains…
Speaking about traditional Finance. Of course, they are compensating you in full. As long as they do not go for insolvency.
So my question is then - is MakerDao solvent or is it insolvent?
If it is not than maybe it will get insolvent, when all the decapitated Bulls (0-bid victims) walk the streets and start a riot (on social media).
Crypto is not so much about technology. It is more about networking and building trust. Please do not mess with your network or you will lose all the trust you earned so far. Rather double down on the trust layer and compensate in full.
Any updates here or are we still waiting?!!
I am about 1 day away from filing another law suit and trust me i’ll deploy resources no problem!!
Hello fellow decapitated bull aka 0-bid victim. Law suits are slow. There will be at least 2 bull runs before you get a single dime. And calculate your time and cost of law suit. Take it out on social media. More effective.
Absolutely agree with you on that social media piece,I’ve been doing exactly that, next step news channels.
Let’s put a group together and move forward as a unified unit to make sure our efforts are focused and that way more effective.
The things that gets me is that it’s not even that much money for MKR to swallow.
Compared to market cap it is but a drop in the ocean.
All negativity could have been warded a long time ago now at little damage to the network.
Instead, the individual pioneers who lost out big are being ignored/dismissed.
Those affected will not stay quiet for long, as is becoming ever more apparent through voices being raised here. The faith that this issue would be addressed by the system is diminishing rapidly.
I am in with the group.
Best would be Twitter. It is googleable. This place is not googlable.
We are ranting alone here, nobody is listening, we are isolated.
Also we need influential people with far reach.
Are you talking about the telegram group? Yes, let’s work together!
One other option would be you guys working together to create your own proposal to Maker Governance on how to handle the compensation.
If you can come up with something in a similar vein to the plan document created by the working group, and it covers the whens and hows adequately, I’m happy to put it up for a vote.
@rune, just want to draw your attention here.
We just witnessed that you made the decision of giving up the PSM module and I admire your sense of responsibility there. (A word on the PSM concept and next steps for the Foundation)
But this vault compensation issue never got your attention.
It will be a time bomb for MakerDao if no action is taken, however far it chugs.
Folks I understand the frustration. I have my own in different frustrations. @equivrel has commented and I completely agree with him that every vault liquidation is a failure of the system both for vault owners and the system itself. While I will still work on the compensation plan until I get something from governance regarding this issue there is not a lot I can do.
I agree with @LongForWisdom I’d love to see vault owners affected by this:
Honestly what I am looking for at this point is having a poll put up on whether the Compensation group should continue to move forward on this - AND money being put up to pay for the work that has been done and to cover work into the future OR governance to say NO - they are done with this. I consider it unfair not just to the compensation group trying to work on this but all of you affected vaults to be left hanging here with no real guidance one way or another on which way this is going to go.
Given that Maker auctioned MKR to raise 5.3M DAI it wouldn’t have been a big deal to have raised another 2-3M and offered it up in a compensation package yet to be determined. Raising the funds or allocating them would have gone a long way to assuaging the angst here and if the funds could have gotten out some of it would probably have dropped right back into Maker vaults and experienced this nice run from 200-300DAI/ETH. Now instead of 1ETH for 200DAI it is 1ETH for 300DAI meaning the cost to maker to compensate either has gone up to give same amount of collateral, OR (the more likely) whatever the amount of collateral returned will be going down.
Literally I am out of ideas at this point for how to get any movement one way or another here except for a singular poll that should be set to run until we get an executive level amount of MKR voting one way or another.
If anyone has better ideas at this point I’d love to hear them. WHile the Compensation commitee still grinds on this I think it would be great for vault owners to form their own Compensation group and put forward a proposal.
As I wrote the compensation group the following is about as simple as it gets for governance.
Regarding ‘condensing’ the proposal. The simplest way for governance to deal with this is to set a pricetag and allow the group to figure out how to fairly distribute it.
Poll (1) Should compensation group continue to work on this issue, AND 1a for governance to put up a bounty for work on this - ongoing - and at completion one way or another. Not sure how/whether to include the whole compensation of the Compensation Plan group in poll 1 but I think governance needs to pony up for work done and work wanted.
Poll (2) Allocate Compensation for BT victions 0M, 1M, 2M, 3M, 4M, 5M DAI. After (1) we can think about (2).
(3) the whole ‘how’ part of compensation we simply leave aside because I think the discussion thorn is going to be (1) whether MKR wants to proceed with any plan. and then the real thorn (2) how much to fund it all with.
A good first start is to halt the thinly veiled threatening language if you want to be taken seriously. Around these parts, you only get anywhere with constructive dialogue sans hyperbole (for instance, this is a “time bomb”). Nevertheless, if you are keen on your current approach and want to attack the Foundation, perhaps you should add your name to the class action lawsuit.
I would have taken 60% in DAI, if you moved fast and payed it out instantly. Actually i would have doubled down and bought MKR directly for it just to celebrate the trust layer. Because MakerDAO is so slow and is causing more damage every day since 0-bid bull decapitation event - now - 100% in USD value (60% in DAI 40% in MKR) schould be sufficient and fair. I would take the 60% and buy MKR to celebrate the trust layer. Every day MakerDAO is not acting, the trust is waning…
In fact the right way was from the start to compensate with the MKR token. We users would have been more than happy. The auction was for nothing.
The MKR token does need more holders and community activity anyway.
Again - we are in a long position for crypto and short position for USD. DAI is just a reference for USD, nothing more. We want crypto, not DAI.
You know - many victims have lost their live savings, or a significant part of it. Some are in suicidal mood- i guess. And you want those people to think straight and put a proposal up?
Please act fast. The clock is ticking.
What MakerDAO wants are signatures for not to be sued. Because if I would sue, than I would go for the full compensation (I am a bit of a lawyer myself) lost gains included. I just don’t want to go trough the hassle. Believe me - You don’t want the hassle aswell.
60% DAI 40% MKR
Actually 100% MKR would be better.
Keep the DAI for governance expenses.
That simple it is.